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ST9302-CS 930923 (2)September 23, 1993 Page 1 Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Dale Sass made a comment concerning secondary roadway treatments. He stated that it was a full brick paver intersection. *Needs to be clarified that this is only a band of brick pavers around the intersection. Dale Sass indicated that there were trees that could be saved on the north side of Sandy Lake Road between Heartz Road and Denton Tap Road and also on the south side of Sandy Lake in the same area. As a point of issue, a question came up very early about the basics of the roadway design. *At this point we should have stopped and addressed the roadway design and spent ten or fifteen minutes to head off various questions. On the east side of Heartz Road, Dale Sass talked about the fact that the existing landscaping will be removed during construction then additional landscaping will be reinstailed. Question came up concerning overhead verses underground utilities. *Need to fh'mly reinforce the fact that there will be overhead utilities. Pecan Ridge, Dale Sass committed to building a stone retaining wall to match the existing wall to preserve some trees in the low area. Dale Sass made a comment at this same point that it is possible to construct a six-lane boulevard with the retaining wall and preserve the tree. *I am unsure as to whether or not that is a factual statement. Dale Sass committed to saving a tree at the intersection of Moore Road and Sandy Lake Road at the southwest comer. Dale Sass made a comment that the road would be lowered to the elevation of the parking lot that serves Georgetown Plaza. *I am unsure whether that is a factual statement. Mr. Sass committed to building a wall on the southwest comer at the intersection of Mockingbird with Sandy Lake Road. Dale committed to the fact that the current landscaping at Georgetown Plaza would stay in place. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 2 *I am not sure whether it will stay in place without the additional retaining wall. Mr. Sass committed to retaining the large trees that are generally associated with the Fountain Park Subdivision. *I am unsure whether or not that is a factual statement. Mr. Sass committed to installing shrubbery along the entire stretch of the wooden fences on the south side. Comment was it certainly was something the city should do. Mr. Sass made a statement that we should provide some screening on the south side of the channel, at the southwest comer of MacArthur and Sandy Lake. The screening would basically be between the existing channel and the existing alley on the south side of the channel. *I am unsure whether the City would be going back there to do screening. A question was asked whether or not the walkway i.e. sidewalks would be shaded. Dale had just showed a picture of a shaded sidewalk of a canape of trees. Question was "is our sidewalk going to be shaded?" Dale's comment was "could be". *I am very doubtful that the City is going to that extensive landscaping to provide an entire shaded sidewalk area. When pressed on the issue "are we or are we not?" Dale's comment was "depends on what you want." *This would almost lead the people to believe that the City is going to provide that much landscaping. I am not sure this is factual. There was lengthy discussion concerning the installation of brick pavers. One lady in particular stated that she was opposed to them, though they look nice, because you could not stop on them and the construction vehicles damage them. At this point, a comment was made by someone that with front wheel drive vehicles you could not accelerate across brick pavers. *I am not sure that is a factual statement by the person in the audience. My research that has been extensive on brick pavers has failed to reach a conclusion as to whether or not they have problems with skid resistance or acceleration. Dale Sass's response to brick pavers was that we may need to look at a different brick that is a new courser bricks on the market. Apparently, Dale Sass is unfamiliar with our subdivision standards. We do specify a certain type of brick to be utilized. *It is a moo~[ issue because he mislead them in the fact that it is going to be a full intersection, which it will not be. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 3 *In our presentation next week, it will probably be wise to repeat aH questions asked so that the entire audience has benefit of the questions asked before the answer is given. There was a comment made by a citizen that once you increase the traffic on Sandy Lake Road you increase the risk of people leaving the roadway and entering the backyards. *That is probably an inaccurate statement. The roadway should be safer once it is improved. Mr. Sass made a comment about brick wails costing millions and millions. He continued that the cost is $150 per linear foot. *Need to verify the price. Issue about the landscaping. Who replaces it if it freezes and dies. Also, on-going maintenance, check the price of on-going maintenance on the landscaping. Mr. Sass made the comment that the City is going to irrigate, maintain and replace it. *That decision as not been determined yet. Comment by Daie that shrubbery cost $10 a foot and brick walls $150 per linear foot. Need to verify cost. A person in the audience stated that the brick wail for Fountain Park was installed for $50 a foot. *Get with Tim House to verify the cost. Question from the audience about the accelerated deterioration of the wooden fence if you have shrubbery adjacent to it. Comment from the audience is whether or not the City will put a four foot barrier between the shrubbery and the fence. Daie Sass comment was that you only need a foot between the shrubbery and the fence to keep the shrubbery from damaging or accelerating the deterioration of the fence. *Need to verify that. Bennett Ra~iff commits to bringing back cost estimates between shrubbery and fence and a recommendation at the next meeting. Question about the speed limit. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 4 *I commit to bring back speed survey for Sandy Lake Road. Comment from lady who lives at the corner of Mapleleaf and Sandy Lake stated that in rainy weather they average three accidents a day. ~1~1~% ~ ~or- *Pull accident reports for Sandy Lake Road. She also indicated that cars on Sandy Lake near Mapleleaf are going 45 mph. *Do speed survey in that general area. Same lady also indicated that there have been a number of deaths on Sandy Lake Road. *Need to verify that. I stated that there are some speed limits possibly 40 mph on MacArthur. *Need to verify speed limit on MacArthur the entire length. Comment about the location of signal lights. Need to have that answered by next Thursday night. Question of whether there is a cost savings if you go informal or formal tree lining. *Need to verify that with Dale Sass. Question concerning the landscaping allowance. Dale Sass set a million and a half. *No figure has been set as of this date. Statement from audience that several people were tired of brick walls and did not want any brick walls on Sandy Lake Road. Question has a noise study been done and what the noise will be from the increase of traffic. Will the landscaping buffer that noise. *Need to investigate this. Bennett Ratliff made a comment that i( mature vegetated buffer will reduce the noise much more than brick wall just because of the reverberation off the wall. The comment concerning whether the rear wooden fence is a City owned fence. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 5 *That is currently being investigated. The same resident requested that the City repair the wooden fenc Ratlift commits to the City looking into individual situations on t will replace or repair it. Walter Pettijohn alludes to a study 1 installation of screening walls adjacent to areas where joggers v *Need to investigate and see if copy of study is around City Hall. He does state that there is a copy in archives. Bennett does commit to research it. There was a comment as to whether or not the City has done environmental impact study. Why have we approached the landscaping prior to the street design. Dale Sass indicated that these decisions will affect the street design. *Need to address that a little more in Thursday nights meeting. Question asked what are we proposing to do in front of the homes that front Sandy Lake. Dale Sass states that at a minimum trees. There was a comment as to whether or not the City would consider building a berm. Dale Sass indicated that there might not be enough room to build a berm. *Need to stress at the next meeting that we are cutting the street down and that in effect we will be building quasar berm. Comment about numerous accidents at Sandy Lake and Raven. *Need to investigate all accidents on Sandy Lake Road. A lady who lives on Raven states that she wishes that the City would block the street off. She will probably get an opportunity to follow through with that on with our current design of Sandy Lake Road. Comment on whether or not there will be anything at Meadowglen and Sandy Lake on the north side. Dale Sass reiterates that the exhibit at the meeting is not a plan but only a map of current existing things on Sandy Lake Road. Question if the road can be shifted south. Question about any improvements to be on Sandy Lake from MacArthur eastward towards Campbell Court. Response was that that was not part of this project but constructed by Dallas County. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 6 ~e,~ ~o,o Question from audience was what is the anticipated volume on Sandy Lake Road when it is i~?o o developed or when it is improved. Will the buffering along Sandy Lake Road bring the north level back down to what it is currently today. Dale Sass indicated again that the City will maintain from fight-of-way to right-of-way, irrigate, maintain and mow. The question is whether or not this has been decided to be a four lane street. *Definitely research old thoroughfare plans. The question is whether or not we need only a two lane road??? I made a comment that Dallas may be building a six lane bridge. *Need to verify what size bridge they are constructing. Comment about Beltline. *Need to check volume on Beltline. Comment about 544. *Need to check that location. Gentleman makes a comment about what he calls Lewisville Blvd. (MacArthur Blvd on North end) He states that there are 400,000 vehicles a day that go over that. *Need to get some traffic counts. Comment as to what Carrollton is doing for us. *Need to stress the fact that it is not Carrollton but the Council of Governments and what they are doing is providing funding for regional thoroughfares. City stands to get $840,000 on Sandy Lake this year and approximately $1,000,000 if another grant approved next year. Mr. Debecca stated that Sandy Lake was scheduled to be a four-lane roadway for at least twenty-five years. Comment that we should build Sandy Lake Road like Parkway Blvd. *Be a major mistake. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 7 Same man who commented about the 400,000 vehicles also states that at one time Coppell was planned to be a major metropolis of 75,000. *Need to verify our population projections at least back to the seventies. Comment from the audience that the citizens actually approved Sandy Lake as four-lane undivided. *Need to verify what was actually told to the voters. Comment made as to whether the landscaping would be located out of the area where a fifth and sixth lane might be located. Dale Sass comment is that we would typically install some trees in that area. Comment from the audience it appears to be sho o build a four-lane know and a six-lane in the future. Same gentleman indicated that it looks like we could break the road up twice in the next ten years instead of just once. Question about what the City was considering the sidewalks or jogging trails. Response was you tell us. *I am not sure we are actually going to give people that much lead way in the project. Rebecca Watson went into a long monologue about alternative ways for transportation. Talked about an alternate path that would be wider than a basic sidewalk meandering away from the street and lighting portions of it. We should consider at least 6 foot sidewalks/paths. Another lady stated that both sides of the roadway need to have this path. Question as to what Carrollton was planning with there roadway i.e., any landscaping? Dale Sass injected that they were planning some type of always program. *I don't believe to be the case. Question as to whether or not the City is required by law to build a four-lane roadway. *Need to investigate. Comment about the fact that we should again go back and build something similar to Parkway Blvd. because Sandy Lake has never had any parking on it. So hence we could restrict the parking and have four-lane without the median. It would probably be very difficult once you build the roadway people will want to park in front of their house or on the side of their house Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 8 as they do on Parkway Blvd. Comment from a gentleman that it is his o 'nio that we don't need to accommodate a large amount of traffic on Sandy Lake. Be short ~on the City's part not to construct a four-lane roadway. The same man makes a comment about future 190. *Need to investigate the alignment of where 190 would be and how it would interact with Sandy Lake Road in moving traffic through Coppell. Same man talks about building a two lane roadway that would have turn lanes at times and then meander within the existing right-of-way. He gives his priorities which are safety, appearance, and then accommodating traffic. *He seems to be a bit confused on what streets are for. *This roadway has been planned since 1972. He has only been here seven months. He should have checked the plans before he bought the house. Should have checked the master plan for the City of Coppell before he bought his house and built his pool. A lady spoke about the last traffic counts on Sandy Lake Road was by the county commission and there was 12,000 vehicles. *Need to provide current traffic counts on Sandy Lake Road. She stated that was before Food Lion and before all the side streets. This lady lives at the corner of Moore and Sandy Lake, the southwest corner, her main concern is turn lanes to facilitate the traffic away from her residence. There was a comment from a person as to whether or not there would be room from the back of the curb to the right-of-way to put jogging trails and/or sidewalks. *Appears to be confused only one of the two will be provided not both. Concern to make sure that we put in what will be low or minimum maintenance on landscaping. There was a comment about the location of crosswalks. Dale Sass proceeded to talk about the fact that there will be crosswalks at most of the streets. I am not sure that we would do that. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 9 A man made the comment that the only way to make it safe at a crosswalk was to put up a stop light. *He was abs~olutely correct. Comment about the height[ at Samuel and Sandy Lake. Dale Sass proceeded to talk about the fact that we will be lowering the high point and raising the low point. *This is incorrect. There was a question whether or not the road can be built within existing City fight-of-way. The response from Bennett was not the whole way. *This is correct. A question from a member of the proposed Luther Church west of Moore Road on the north side of Sandy Lake whether or not any flexibility in working with the landscaping plans to come up with something that accentuates their church. Robert indicated that construction would not start before January, 1995. Question about the length of the project. Robert's response was 11/2 to 2 years. Question about the possibility of burying the utility lines. Robert responded that the cost usually was more expensive to put them underground. He went on to state that typically franchise utility companies will charge for the difference in going underground as opposed to going overhead. Need to investigate that via our franchise agreement. Question from Rebecca Watson on what would happen to the trees that would be relocated off this project. Dale Sass responded that if they are 6 inches or less a tree spade would be used and the tree relocated. Question was asked about how much money has been spent on the project so far. There answer was approximately $40,000. Question, whether or not we would have to survey the project again prior to construction. The response was no there is permanent control already set on the project. A man requested that small shrubs be put at the street and trees further back. Question about the lighting for the walkways where it is coming from. Response was lighting would be down the center median. Comment, If that is the case then we need to address the blind areas with some additional lighting along the pathways. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 10 Question, are fences along Woodridge going to have to be removed? Response, if they are, they are replaced as good or better. Man made comment, he knows someone getting ready to put up a fence. Robert's response was if they put up a new fence and the contractor damages it then it will be replaced with a new fence. Question, when will the conceptual plan for Sandy Lake will be complete. Robert's response was by December, 1993. Comment from avid bicyclist he would not ride his bicycle on Sandy Lake Road due to the air pollution. Comment as to how much the street improvements at the southwest comer of Sandy Lake and MacArthur is going to cost. One man indicated that he envisions mass transit on Sandy Lake in the future and had a question if we would have pickup stations. Same man commenting earlier. Sandy Lake Road Public Meeting September 23, 1993 Page 11 Things to be done prior to Thursday evening, September 30, 1993 1. Contact TU Electric concerning overhead verses underground utilities along Sandy Lake Road. 2. Check cost of typical brick walls and also contact Tim House to check cost of walls in Fountain Park. Tim Clancy/Metroplex $35-$50 L.F. Tim House/Matthews Southwest $50-$55 L.F. w/retaining wall $75 L.F. 3. Provide speed survey for Sandy Lake Road. Traffic counts attached 4. Obtain all accident reports for Sandy Lake Road (including any deaths). 5. Verify speed limits on MacArthur Blvd. Traffic counts attached 6. See if copy of study by Paul Geisel concerning screening walls and noise is available at City Hall. 7. Check anticipated volume on Sandy Lake Road when it is developed. 8. Research old thoroughfare plans. 9. Call Dallas County to verify what size bridge they are constructing for the City of Dallas and also what type of amenities they are providing for the portion of Sandy Lake in Carrollton. According to Bill Jessup with Dallas County, the bridge will be built at 6 lanes and no amenities will be provided unless the City of Coppell pays for them. 10. Check traffic volume on Beltline Road. Traffic counts attached 11. Call TXDOT to determine if there is a future highway numbered 544 and 190 and their locations. According to TxDot FM 544 borders the City of Lewisville and PIano and does not include Coppell and SH 190 currently terminates at Interstate 35E and interchanges with itself however there are future plans for a SH 161/190 connector freeway that links SH 190 (Trinty Mills with Valley View Lane at SH 635. The route (2) perferred would be located on the east levee of the Elm Fork Trinity River. 12. Traffic counts for MacArthur Blvd. Traffic counts attached 13. Verify population projection. 14. Provide traffic counts for Sandy Lake Road. Traffic counts attached